Transcript

0:00
You're listening to better than before breast cancer with the breast cancer recovery coach, I'm your host, Laura Lummer. I'm a certified life coach and I'm a breast cancer thriver. In this podcast, I will give you the skills on the insides and the tools to move past the emotional and physical trauma of a breast cancer diagnosis if you're looking for a way to create a life that's even better than before breast cancer, you've come to the right place. Let's get started.

0:34
Hey, friends, welcome to episode 429 of better than before breast cancer. I'm your host, Laura Lummer, the breast cancer recovery coach, and I am really excited to share today's episode with you, because we have a very special guest today. Her name is Dr Tony Ingram, and she is a biological dentist. Biological dentistry is something I'd really never heard of until I started studying the integrative approach to health, the metabolic approach to health, the metabolic approach to cancer, something that I just never really heard mentioned, but it's a very integrative approach to dental health. And something that's so important about that that we're going to hear today is like, what does this mean? How does dental health really impact our overall wellness in our body? What about the materials used in dentistry? What is what is biological dentistry even mean? And how is that different from regular dentistry? I get a lot of questions about this from my clients, so I am so excited to be able to ask these questions of Dr Ingram today. Let me tell you a little bit about her. She's a biological dentist and an integrative health coach. She's the owner of the flourish dental boutique in Richardson, Texas, and after her own personal health struggles with autoimmune disease, Dr Ingram shifted her practice philosophy to focusing on whole body health and the prevention and safer treatment of oral disease. She has degrees from Texas Christian University and Baylor College of Dentistry. She's a member of the Academy of oral medicine and toxicology, otherwise known as I, a O M T. She's also a member of the International Academy for biological dentistry and medicine. She is smart, certified in safe amalgam removal techniques and accredited through the I, A, O, m, t, and she is an ambassador through the breathe Institute. She's also a certified Integrative Health Coach through the Institute of Integrative Nutrition. So super smart lady, I cannot wait for you to hear her story and to hear how this practice can be such a wonderful thing for us to dig into, and another opportunity to have the power to support our overall wellness. So without further ado, let me introduce you to Dr Tony Ingram, welcome Dr Ingram, so happy to have you on the show today. So much. I like it like take up your whole afternoon, because there's so much I want to learn from you. So we'll just dig right in. And I'd love first to just hear about you and your story and your journey and what led you to do what you're doing now,

3:11
it was definitely not my intention to do anything holistic or biological. I didn't know what biological Dentistry was when I was in dental school, but thankfully, God had other plans. And you know, when I got out of dental school, I just hit the ground running, and was working really hard. Was working full time as an associate dentist. I had a toddler at home, so I was a new mom, and I was opening my first practice from scratch. I was doing a scratch startup, and was, it was just too, clearly, it was too much for me, because I got super sick, started having all kinds of GI issues. Was in the bathroom, like 10 to 20 times a day, sometimes, my gosh, and it was, it was not, it was not fun. And started, you know, finally, went to the doctor, and again, you know, no holistic background at all. So I'm going to conventional doctors. Went to a gastroenterologist, and he's like, okay, Tony, you know, this is probably just some IBS, you know, here's take some peppermint tea and call me in a few months. Well, I didn't get any better, and then I started losing weight, and I was not trying to lose weight, and started bleeding, having bloody stools. So I went back. I was like, hello, this is this can't be good. And so so did a colonoscopy, which is super fun, as a 30 year old, to do a colonoscopy, wow, and found that I had Crohn's Colitis, and was given, you know, he was very kind, and he was surprised at what he found, and he gave me a very western meta. An answer was, you hear your list of medications that you're going to take until they stop working, then we'll put you on stronger meds, and, oh, by the way, there's about a 40% chance you'll need surgery at some point to lose all or part of your colon. And I was like, wait that I I'm sorry I don't have time for that. I was like, you know, you'll get it. Like, how do I get rid of this? How do I not have this anymore? What should I be eating or not eating? And he looked at me. He's like, Tony, your diet has nothing to do with this.

5:36
Wow, really, nothing to do with your digestive tract.

5:40
That's exactly, exactly,

5:45
you know, I'm I'm in the south. So now I say bliss is a little

5:49
heart good for you.

5:52
So I just didn't that answer did not sit right with me. So I did take the medications, and I'm so so fortunate because I did, the medications did get me into remission really quickly, and that really gave me the space that it gave me, bought me time to be able then to do my own homework and figure out, how do I actually heal? Because I don't believe what he's telling me, that this is my fate and this is a life sentence. And so thankfully, I did find what worked for me. You know, I pieced things together, and I didn't know what functional medicine was. So I was doing. I was just becoming my own doctor. And I found a diet, found diet practices that worked for me, lifestyle that worked for me. I learned to listen to my body a whole lot more because I was not doing that. That was not the culture I was brought up in. I was brought up in perform, perform, perform, and ignore what your body's telling you so you can perform some more. And that just didn't my body said, enough's enough. And so as I was going through that healing process, I just saw the correlations between what I was treating in my own body and what I help my patients with every single day. So Crohn's disease, it's an autoimmune condition, but it's all about inflammation. It's an inflammatory condition caused in large part by a dysbiosis, by this imbalance in the bacteria in the gut. Well, gosh, what do I treat? Every day I treat tooth decay and gum disease. It's all about inflammation and an imbalance in the very first part of your gut. So I knew that if I could figure out how to get myself well well, that I had the ethical and the moral responsibility to figure out how to do the same thing for my patients. And so that's exactly what I did. I started feeling better. I finally weaned myself off of all the medications, so I've been in remission. I would say I no longer have Crohn's disease, and haven't for over a decade. And now that's what I help my patients do, too, is we find we find the root causes for them. We get to the heart of the matter. We figure out where the imbalances are, and we try to bring homeostasis back to their mouth so that they can absorb the nutrients that they're eating, so they can have healthy gum tissue, healthy bone structure and healthy teeth.

8:39
Love it. You know, couple things you said that really stood out to me is, one, do you think that a lot of people miss the connection that the mouth is the beginning of the digestive tract, like they're not really that doesn't sink into a lot of people, don't you think and the microbiome in the mouth and how it impacts us?

8:56
Worse than that, I missed it myself as a dentist for years and years. Yes, it's it's unfortunate that we have separated these we've intellectually separated the mouth from the rest of the body, but you're 100% right. It is. It's so intricately connected. Not only is it the first part of your digestive tract, but it's a direct entrance into your circulatory system, because all the mucosa that you have in your mouth, all the pink stuff, is so highly absorbent, and it's a direct entrance into your respiratory system. It's meant to be your backup entrance, because you're supposed to be breathing through your nose, but when you can't, you get this direct entrance, you know, God's natural backup system, into your respiratory system. So it's just key to connecting all of these different systems within the body.

9:54
So good. And you know, I have a background also in Ayurveda and tongue diagnosis and. Working in someone's mouth is just an important aspect of the overall, just a physical assessment of somebody. Do you have cracks in your tongue, coating scalloped tongue? What does your mouth look like? And people, it's so funny when you look at someone's tongue and say, Oh, are you feeling this? Are you feeling that? And they think you're a fortune teller or something, and it's like, no, this is just a visual of what's happening inside your gut, right? So it's so cool, yeah. And I love the other thing you said, especially with, you know, the my audience, which of course, is primarily people who've had a cancer diagnosis that sometimes like there is goodness to standard of care, that if you're going to the bathroom 20 times a day, you don't have time to figure out how to heal yourself. Sometimes it's that medicine, whether it's for our emotional, mental health or our physical health, that gives us enough space and comfort freedom from pain and discomfort so we can look into what can serve us and believe that we can start to support our body's own ability to heal. I love that, and it doesn't have to be a forever thing, right? I think, unlike what you shared, a lot of people think, Oh God, once I start a med, that's it, I'm on it forever. And it doesn't have to be like that. It can be a really beneficial bridge. So I love your story. I'm so it's so beautiful that you believed in yourself, right? You trusted the intuition of the body, which is, I think, a critical factor in healing. So tell me what biological dentistry is like. What is the core difference between conventional dentistry and biological dentistry? And just like, what are the core principles there?

11:36
Yeah. So I'll start super high level, and then I'll get down into, like, practically speaking, what that actually means, and put it in English. So super high level, we're using the concepts from biological medicine, which is we're going beyond the germ theory of disease. And germ theory just says, you know, one germ causes one illness, and so therefore one chemical, you know, one one thing can cure sad illness, and it looks at the terrain theory of disease. So what are we doing to protect and support the health of the terrain, which is the entire human body? How are we either contributing to health? And so from a dental perspective, what am I doing in your mouth? What am I helping you do that supports the health of your entire body, or what's going on in your mouth that might be contributing to disease and dysfunction elsewhere in the body, and so it's taking just this whole body approach to wellness in the mouth, specifically, practically speaking, what that means is, yes, it is whole body. So very much holistic care, we focus on prevention and nutrition first, and then only if we need to intervene, then we intervene, and when we do, we're much more intentional with the products and the materials that we use. So I am very concerned and cognizant of what's in my filling material, what's in the toothpaste that my hygienists are using, what's in the crown material, and is that contributing to a patient's health, or is it not, you know, more nitty gritty things that you'll recognize is, I don't have any fluoride in my practice at all the those old silver fillings. It not only do we not have them and don't use them, but we are very, very specific with how we remove them, because removing them actually creates this pretty intense heavy metal exposure just from the removal process itself. And so those are the things that you'll you'll notice, first and foremost, most likely,

14:04
can you speak to like, why is that important? Of why? I mean, we've been told forever, use a fluoride toothpaste. We use whitening toothpaste, we use fluoride toothpaste. We I mean, you know, most people, I think, as kids, you know, we have cavities. We've got silver fillings, right? And it became you could get the white ones because it looks prettier. You don't have the color. But how do those materials impact our health? And why would we not want to use them? And What materials do to use how does it impact us?

14:33
Well, the silver fillings, I think were in were an easier jump for my dear sweet colleagues, because it's, you know, those old silver fillings, they are literally 50% mercury and 50% silver, 10 and a whole bunch of other random metals to make this gooey structure that starts out soft and then hard. Hardens once we place it in the teeth. And what we were taught in dental school is that once you mix the mercury with these other metals, that then it's chemically bound, which is true, it's chemically bound, but they would say that then the mercury vapor cannot escape. It is chemically changed, and so there is no risk of mercury exposure after the fact. But what we know now is that there actually is and the half life of mercury within a dental filling is 50 years. Whoa, 50 years. Whoa, so those fillings that you got as a kid, you are still leaking just a little bit of mercury vapor every time heat or friction is applied to those teeth. So that means when you chew, when you brush your teeth, when you grind or clench your teeth at night, when you drink hot coffee, all of those things will create these little micro exposures. Well, what happens when dentist, a very well meaning dentist, wants to remove them, and we take a high speed dental drill at, you know, 800,000 RPMs to that tooth, you're going to get this huge exposure. And so we want to make sure that when we do those types of procedures that we are protecting you, the patient, that we're protecting ourselves, and we're protecting our assistants who are in the room from that mercury exposure. So thankfully, you know, I we can't get, we haven't been able to get as many of our colleagues to recognize the risk from removing these as much as we want, but at least they are. They're phasing out, and I have very few colleagues who are still placing those fillings. And the FDA has helped with this some and that they finally said that, you know, hey, these mercury fillings are probably not the best option for pregnant women and children or or anyone sensitive to them, which you know, in I would say, is 100% of people would be sensitive to mercury exposure,

17:16
yeah, yeah, for sure. And the other metals, right? Those are in there as well,

17:21
yeah, not to mention the other metals, for sure. Now, fluoride, on the topic of fluoride, that that, I think is, is a tougher sell for for dentists and the American Dental Association, it seems like we're, we're just so entrenched in our education that said that this was the greatest public health advancement of the 20th century. The CDC still says that that water fluoridation is the greatest health advance. What what I've noticed lately, and by lately, I mean, you know, the last 10 years or so is that we were a bit oversold on the benefits of fluoride. So, yes, tooth decay did decrease when we started adding fluoride to our water half a century ago, but it also decreased in other parts of the world where they did not add fluoride to the water.

18:24
Interesting, right?

18:27
So, so tooth decay decreased everywhere. And the factors that went into that are, are many. So, yes, it's lifestyle. It is, you know, increase of tooth brushing. It's a lot of things that it's better access to food. So better, slightly better diets, even though it's still pretty scary out there, diet wise. So all of these things contributed to a lower rate of tooth decay. So we can't necessarily give all the credit to fluoride. Okay? At the same time, more and more studies have come out recently that are linking higher levels of fluoride with other health effects. So the most notable, and I think the most angering honestly is the decrease in IQ of our children. Those who are exposed to more levels of fluoride have a lower IQ, which is terrifying as a mom. It just makes me absolutely furious. Yeah, and the issue with that when it comes to fluoride in our water is that we cannot control the dose. You can't control the dose when fluoride is in the water. So, so we don't actually know. I mean, if you think about it, you know you've got a, let's say, a 70 year old. You. 200 pound man who drinks one glass of tap water a day, and then you've got a 15 pound infant who whose mom is feeding them formula mixed with tap water. So the dose of fluoride per kilogram of body weight is going to be vastly different in those two scenarios, right? And it's really difficult to tell you know how much fluoride is, is each person absorbing, and how much her is getting passed through. So because we cannot control the dose, we really don't know yet what level of fluoride in our water is safe and what level is not, and that is the issue that we have. So it if we were to, you know, go, hopefully 10 years in the future and none of our water is fluoridated anymore, which I'm very I'm hopeful for honestly, then I might feel better about my patients using fluoride in a toothpaste, or, you know, if our products in the dental office have a little bit of fluoride in it, because then we know the dose. We know the dose, and we can control it, and we know what level is harmful for certain people, and what level is completely safe, but until then, we don't know what that level is, and so I'm no longer willing to to use fluoride or to recommend it, or to even have it in my practice. So we filter it out of our water as soon as it comes in, we are constantly calling out our dental materials, because we actually have to call in dental supplies. It's, you know, fluoride isn't on the label like it is for consumer products. So we actually have to call manufacturers and say, Okay, does this cement have any fluoride in it? Does this whitening gel have any fluoride in it, because it's not necessarily on the label. And so it's a process until we know exactly what dose is safe, what dose is not safe, and we can control that dose, then we've just planted our flag in the ground that we're not going to

22:20
have it. Yeah, do you recommend for your patients that they get a some kind of water filtration system that does remove fluoride in their homes? Yeah? I do, yeah, yeah, to look for that. So I think that's an important thing about water filters. A lot of people just think get a water filter. But isn't it kind of important to understand what's in your tap water to get filters that, you know, can filter those specific things out of your tap water, right?

22:44
And fluoride is one of those things that's a super, super tiny particle. So it really needs to be reverse osmosis filtration in order to get it out. You're not going to do it with a Brita filter. You know, with any kind of charcoal filter, it's not going to do it. And so I do, I do like reverse osmosis for that. And I thankfully, if you are using a reverse osmosis filter, then it's going to also filter out some of those chemical, like pharmaceutical contaminants that can be in the water supply too.

23:16
So what do you so you said earlier that you're you do the exam, and you said, if I need to intervene, then we intervene in this careful way, but we're looking at the whole system. What does that mean? Can you expand on what you're looking for and what that means?

23:30
I firmly believe that most of the time less dentistry is the best dentistry. So if I can catch something early. Or better yet, if I can catch people who are just showing initial signs of imbalance, like maybe their PH, the pH of their saliva, is a little acidic, or maybe we see a saliva test and they've got a couple of pathogens, or, you know, even more advanced, and we're seeing clinical signs, like just the beginning signs of a cavity or a little bit of gingivitis here and there. The ideal is for us to be able to make tweaks to what you are doing at home. So tweaks to your diet Are you are you taking in enough of the right nutrients. Asking about your gut health, are you absorbing the nutrients that you're taking in adequately and being able to to make those little shifts so that your body has what it needs to heal on its own? Because I firmly believe that that your bodies are meant to heal. All of us, our bodies are meant to heal and to be well, and we just need to make sure that they have what they need to do. So So that's always the goal is we start with nutrition prevention, and we start with things that don't involve drilling or cut. Saying, if at all possible,

25:02
wow, is it possible for so if you see the beginning of a cavity, can a body stop or reverse a cavity once it started? Or can really, absolutely, yeah, never heard that.

25:16
Yes, amazing. And it and any dentist who doesn't say that did not pay attention in school. So it's this is something like even the mainstream, like even in dental school, we were taught that a cavity, what we call an incipient lesion. It just means a very, very small cavity within the enamel, within that outer layer of tooth structure still has the ability to re mineralize and heal, and so that's what we want to do, is we want to help the enamel re mineralize. Now, what they also tell us is, once it gets past the enamel into that second layer of tooth structure called the dentin. Then in dental school, they told us that at that point it's not possible to re mineralize things and get the lesion to heal. Okay, I would say, I leave space for miracles all the time. And so it is possible to get it to heal, but it's much harder. And once it's in the innate into the dentin, into that second layer of tooth structure, then we are typically talking about some kind of restoration, a filling or whatever the case may be. Okay.

26:29
Can you speak to so when you have a cancer diagnosis, is there something that you know? Because also, as the integrative health coach that you are, how the microbiome in the mouth, obviously, is going to be affected by the treatments we go through, chemotherapy, radiation, and the drugs, the aromatase inhibitors, scrms, all of that kind of stuff. How does it impact us? And I know that from my clients, a lot of people, when they get a diagnosis, they get scared and they think, Oh, my God, I got to get all these metal fillings out of my mouth, then they get scared, because they hear, as you mentioned a minute ago, well, that can create a big toxic burden. So and also, as we spoke just before we started this podcast, was some of the medications, like Zometa, we're told you must be off this for three months before you do any kind of drilling of any kind, because you could get jaw necrosis, and then that is a medication that I take. So it's really scary, because I think was three months the minimum safe distance. Should I be off for six months? How do I know? So I think a lot of people who are already fearful of dentistry, who either shy more away from it, or who are fearful of the burden of metals, might jump in and do dental procedures at a time when maybe it's not an ideal time. So can you speak to all of that, like, how do we know what's safe, how it's impacting us, and how we can support ourselves in the best way?

27:53
That's when I think it's just really, really important that your providers are all working together, because you're all of these concerns are valid, and a lot of times it's just a matter of timing things correctly. You know, we don't want to give your body too much to have to work on at once. And so being smart and being intentional with the timing, I think, is really key. And so if we can get, you know the oncologist, the integrative physician, the primary care, the the dentist. If we can get everybody talking and and collaborating on, okay, it makes sense to do this at this point of treatment or before this treatment, but not before this one, then it really can be a collaborative effort to where we can get it all, we can get it all done. But I agree, and when patients come into my practice and they've had a diagnosis like that, like some kind of cancer diagnosis, and they do, they want to do it all at once, but they're scared, and so it's really hard to know what makes sense when, and we just have to all get on the same page, because it is different for every patient. Sometimes it makes sense to do dental work first, and sometimes it doesn't.

29:12
Are most standard of care oncologists open to that discussion with you? Is it easy to kind of get on the team and work with them?

29:20
You know, I've been pleasantly surprised. Most oncologists have been more than will willing to have a conversation. Now they I let them and the patient lead the way on that, not because I don't want to step on toes, but because I feel like them, they're the more urgent health issue going on, my job is just to support. My job is to only do things in the mouth that are going to support them healing and support whatever they're doing with the oncologist, and not add to the burden that. Your body is already having to deal with. And so they they are always more than willing to speak with me, although they have said, the only thing that I've been surprised, and I shouldn't be surprised with, is, some have said, you know, when we're doing treatment, if we're doing something surgical, then I will usually have my patients do IV vitamin therapy, as you know, at the end of their treatment, and I've had some oncologists tell me no, that they don't want any kind of IV vitamin C with their dental appointment,

30:35
yeah, because they're not sure how that interacts with their chemo, or they should be having antioxidant, right? If cancer uses it. Yeah. So when are there things that, if we're in active treatment of some kind, are there things we can be doing to support and like safeguard ourselves? Are there mouth rinses or something we should be aware of that would be a great idea for regular practice, in addition to brushing and flossing

31:00
Absolutely. And I would say, if you're beginning any kind of treatment, go ahead and just right now, before you even start ditch any kind of mouthwash that has alcohol in it. I would say, Let's get really, really simple and clean and supportive with anything that you're going to use in your mouth. And so for a lot of people, that might mean just good old salt water, water and sea salt can be a really soothing rinse and can kill enough bacteria can help the gum tissue, and that can be all we need. Now, if we are in the middle of some treatment and you're having side effects that are impacting the mouth or impacting the oral mucosa, where things are inflamed, or we'll have gum tissue that's sloughing off here and there. It can be uncomfortable, can be painful, sometimes. Then we've got other things that we can use. As you know, we can compound prescription mouthwashes. I've got a homeopathic mouth rinse that's really good, that was designed for specifically for people with dry mouth and people going through chemo and radiation. And so we've got tools in our tool belt if side effects are causing the mouth not to feel well. But otherwise, I would say, let's just get really, really simple, because we want to support the microbiome and create as little damage as possible, so that once you're done with treatment, then we can replenish things back with with good nutrients, with oral probiotics, and we can re establish balance.

32:51
Great. So for people who might be interested in having fillings replaced or getting some kind of procedure, can you speak to like, what is smart amalgam removal? What does that mean? What are the safeguards there?

33:05
Yeah, so smart is just an acronym for safe mercury amalgam removal technique, and it was created by a group with another really long name. It's the I, A, O, m, t, that's the International Academy of oral medicine and toxicology, and they developed these protocols to minimize any kind of mercury exposure during the removal of amalgam fillings, because they found, you know, they discovered these plumes of mercury vapor that we were all being exposed to in the dental operatory room when you were having amalgam fillings replaced, and so it really just creates these layers of protection for the procedure itself. So we use tools that isolate the tooth that we're working on these dental barriers called dental dams, that really create a seal around the tooth. We use special suction devices air filtration that can filter out the mercury vapor, and also, you know, pulls it away from us, away from the three people in the room as we're working, everybody in the in the room is covered, typically from head to toe. So you know, our hair is covered. We're we're all geared up the patient and the staff to make sure that anything we're exposed to is either filtered or covered and protected from it as best as possible.

34:43
Wow, it's like a hazmat situation. It's a big deal.

34:48
And it, you know, it's funny. That was the that was the hardest thing I think for me to take the leap and do as I transitioned my practice to a holistic practice. Um. Was like, man, is this gonna our patients gonna be so scared of the way, the way our gear looks during these appointments? But I found that, you know, once I explain that this is for everybody's safety, and I'm not gonna compromise my own safety or my assistant safety, I'm not gonna compromise yours to either? Then everybody is is more than happy to wear the hazmat looking suit for for a period of time?

35:30
Sure. Yeah. I mean, I wouldn't want to poison other people, you know, with my mercury, if that was situation. Yeah, right. So what do you think is I want two things I want to know about what are misconceptions? You know? So when we talk about integrative care in the spectrum of health, or people who are going through cancer treatment, there's all kinds of misconceptions and myths and all of that type of belief systems. Do you find the same thing in the biological dentistry versus conventional and if so, what? What is that? What would you like to clear the air about,

36:04
man, I

36:07
I think the the first thing that I try to remind myself of every day, and I also try to remind my colleagues and I try to remind my patients, is the healthcare and medicine, it takes a lot of humility to understand that we don't know what we don't know, and the things that we are so sure of right now we may find to be not true later, and that's okay and and we don't know everything. So So I think that's where we have to start. But I would say right now the I get misconceptions on both sides. So a huge misconception from my my colleagues, is that biological dentistry is not based in science, and that's completely false, completely false. So it is evidence based, it is science based, and and it's really takes a ton of study to be able to have the courage to say, oh, maybe what my colleagues believe, or have been telling me my entire career isn't quite right, or isn't the whole story. And then on the other side, you know, I get all kinds of misconceptions from the from people who are already really, really holistically minded. Call them my super crunchy crowd, like crunchy granola. Yeah, I think sometimes they they expect us to to work miracles with neglect, and that's not possible either. So you can't, you can't have it both ways. And I really appreciate a more integrative approach, where, yes, we have a lot of wonderful modern tools and techniques and methods, and I'm so thankful for them. You know, like you said earlier, I'm thankful for medications that we have. I'm thankful for dental materials that we have. Even, you know, back in the day, it those amalgam fillings, they served a purpose for a time, and so for that reason, I'm grateful for that, because it served a purpose for a period of time. But now your our world is a bit toxic. Our exposures are a bit too toxic to be able to use that safely and ethically anymore. So I just think it takes balance, and that's what I'm always seeking to do, is to have some balance to use the tools that God gave me, to use the tools that God gave us, that we created, that are man made, and to know, know when I don't know everything

39:07
I love that, yeah, is there, you know? So most people, most women, are diagnosed with breast cancer after menopause, right in the mid 50s, is the average diagnosis. Unfortunately, that's getting younger and younger, but then, even when after the diagnosis, the medications we are put on, or if we go through chemotherapy, we're put into chemically induced menopause. Does being a menopause level up the kind of care you need for your teeth in the same way that it impacts our bones? Right internally, we don't see we get told all about osteopenia, osteoporosis, does that affect our teeth also?

39:44
You know, I love that. You said, level up. So, so, yeah, in some ways, it levels up, but not necessarily for everybody. I think, like everything, these changes in life create shifts. And so for some people, the shift is, is really. Really positive. And for some people, the shift means, okay, now it's bringing to light things in our bodies that need more care, or things that maybe we were able to get away with neglecting that now we can't.

40:14
And so to be young and be able to be neglectful, right?

40:18
Right? So our hormones and how they change plays a huge role in the health of our mouths, and it's different for every person. But yes, as our estrogen declines, as our progesterone declines, then we'll have less saliva. We're more prone to having inflammation in the gum tissue, and just those two things, dried out mouth that's a little more inflamed, that in itself, can create this whole icky, nasty cycle of either tooth decay or gum disease, or both, that We need to pay attention to. And then sometimes, sometimes that's not the case. Sometimes I can see when I look in your mouth that things are out of balance. But it's not an oral origin. It is, Hey, your hormones are just out of whack. Wow.

41:19
And you could tell that from looking in someone's mouth at times,

41:22
yeah, yeah, oh yeah, because like it, I can tell when imbalance in your mouth is plaque induced. Or, you know, is there actual oral disease present? Is there gum disease? Is there tooth decay? Or is there not, was this a lack of brushing and flossing, or was it not, or do you just really need to see your your functional medicine provider? You know? Is it time to get some hormone testing, and maybe it's time to do some bio identical hormones? So it really is just so dependent on each person, and some of us fly through these hormonal changes, and all of the changes are wonderful and been advantageous. And sometimes it is a it's like a knock on the door, like, hello, you've been ignoring me for too long, and now you can't

42:20
Yeah, so I've got to ask the question that I know everyone's thinking, How much does this cost, right, when it comes to integrative care, or something outside the conventional world, is it covered by insurance? What do people do? How do people manage it financially?

42:37
Yeah, so this is something that's really important to me, and I don't have a solve for it yet, but I'm working on it. I would say that the way that I feel I must practice it doesn't allow me to be in a contract with an insurance company, so I'll use them. We file insurance claims all the time. I just can't be contractually obligated to to their rules, their fee schedules, because I wouldn't be able to to sustain that, because I've done that before and it was not sustainable. Yeah, yeah. And so. So we're what's called out of network with all the insurance companies, but we still file claims. As far as the cost, i My goal is that if you work for us, and we're to work with us and and we're doing our job as providers, then you're going to spend less on dental care over the course of your life. That is my goal. We also have, you know, all kinds of easy financing and membership programs. I'm really, really excited about the free dental care that we do. We do a program that I call first fruits Fridays, where we take applications to perform free dental care for people. So I am Access to care is something that I'm I'm really, really passionate about, and I haven't solved it yet, but I'm working on it. And if your audience has more ideas, please send them my way.

44:22
Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. I mean, it's a tough thing, right? Because, I mean, good care, it's everything's costly. Good materials are costly. Good people that are trained in these practices are costly, right? So it does make sense. And I think a lot of times, I think we have to begin to really open our mind to be outside of the conventional what does it cost, and what does insurance cover? And kind of open ourselves up a little more to what other opportunities exist there. And I love what you said. It's like at the end of the day, we may be spending less if we're having the proper kind of care, right? Yeah, yeah. What would you say? Because I have to let you go, or I could ask you a million other questions, because when you talk about dry mouth, I start thinking about sleep apnea, and how's that affecting people? You know, there's so many things,

45:10
root canals, I get a ton of questions about root canals.

45:13
And, yeah, what are your thoughts on root canals? Is there a need for root canals? Are they as dangerous as some people are concerned. They are what, what's the deal with root canals?

45:24
We what's interesting is that we don't completely know yet. What we know is that when you have a root canal, it changes the microbiome in the area, and so you will get an immune response because everything has shifted. The tooth no longer has a blood supply, and so your blood is what brings oxygen to the area. When you don't have oxygen, all of the normal, beneficial bacteria that are oxygen loving, these aerobic bacteria can no longer survive, and so it becomes the anaerobic bacteria that then take over. And they can kind of be like the bottom feeder, the the bottom of the ocean floor dweller kind of bacteria the creepy crawlies. And so they will create a different immune response, and sometimes an inflammatory response. And so I think there is, I think there's a valid concern, especially if you've got a root canal and you notice health issues on that same side of the body. And so we can't, science doesn't allow us to directly connect the two. Not saying that that won't happen at some point, but I think it's enough to be concerned, and it's enough that many of my patients are concerned. And so we will do some elective procedures where they will ask to have teeth removed that have had root canals, if they are concerned about certain health impacts,

47:05
interesting, yeah, okay, we're gonna have to have you back on to talk about more of this stuff and sleep apnea and all that. But I'd love to know from you what top three dental oral health let's just not just say Dental, because I think we only think of teeth, but let's think of our whole mouth, right? Oral health practices that you would say everybody really should be doing this.

47:24
Oh, it's, I mean, top three is,

47:30
we know brushing is one, right? Is it one brushing?

47:34
Yeah, okay, so let's not even talk about that. Yeah. Let's not do that. Say, I would say a nutrient dense diet, is number one. Oral Hygiene will put all of that together. You know, cleaning cleaning your teeth and using something to clean in between your teeth. I think that's two. And then I think if I heard correctly, you're going to like the last one, but I think tongue scraping is really fantastic practice. Yeah, can

48:07
you speak? I think a lot of people probably don't even have never heard of tongue scraping. You want to talk

48:12
about for a sec? Well, you were talking about it as an Ayurvedic practice, and so it's been used for 1000s of years and in Ayurveda as a way to to rid the body of toxins. Well, clinically speaking, you know, from a Western medicine standpoint, what we want to do is we want to thin out the biofilm in the mouth. And so your tongue has all of these nooks and crannies. It's super bumpy. So there are just tons of places for bacteria to hide and for a biofilm, which is like a whole city ecosystem of bacteria to form. And it gets thicker and thicker if we don't thin it out, if we don't disrupt the biofilm. And so if, if you've ever used a tongue scraper, you know that it works way better than just taking a toothbrush to your tongue. So I love tongue scraping as a practice. Awesome.

49:14
Yeah. So for anybody listening, and you stick out your tongue and you see this big, thick, white coating that's all forest happening right there, right Yes, cut that for us down. Get a tongue scraper. Yeah, that's awesome. Is there anything that I haven't asked you about that you think people should be aware of when it comes to biological dentistry?

49:35
I mean things that we could talk about for forever? I would say, I would say the most important thing is just knowing that your body is designed to heal. It's how we were, how we were

49:47
built. I love that. I love that, and I love that whole team approach. I just think that's so important to have to realize that. I think even though science has really siloed everything right, it's moved away. Or two, everyone's a specialist on something which has taken us completely away from the fact that the body works together and the mouth is part of the body and the digestive tract. So I love that whole team approach to wellness, especially for someone who's in treatment or trying to heal from disease. I think that's awesome. So I'm going to put a link so you've got a great social media I was checking out your Instagram. There's so much people can learn about you there, and the links to your practice. Is there any like what's the best way for people to get a hold of you? Should they go to your website? Should they call the office? Travel to Texas so you can get some good biological dental care?

50:36
We are happy to have you in Texas. We will roll out the red carpet for you. You're right. Probably are. Most of my educational stuff is on Instagram and on different social media channels. So at Dr Tony Ingram is where you can find me. There our website, if you want to learn about the practice itself, that's www, dot flourish, dot Dental. And we're right outside of the Dallas area. Like I said, we're happy to we have a lot of patients who who live far, they may want to fly in for specific things. You know, if they if their root canals are a concern, if their amalgam fillings are a concern, and they'll come to us and just address those, the big stuff, and then we, you know, we'll treat you like family for for a few days, and then send you back home to your regular dentist. So we're happy to do that too. If you're not close,

51:28
love that. That's awesome. That's great to know. Well, thank you so much. We're gonna have to have you on for a continuation, because, yes, there's just so much that is so fascinating about this, but it's absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for coming on the show and sharing all those insights with us.

51:44
Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate it.

51:49
You've put your courage to the test, laid all your doubts to rest. Your mind is clearer than before, your heart is full and wanting more, your future's at the door.

52:07
Give it all you got no

52:10
hesitating. You've

52:13
been waiting all your

52:19
life. This is your moment.

52:38
This is your moment. Magic star you.